Lewis Nurney from UFit Podiatry, Singapore is a dynamic UK podiatrist whose career could have started in the National Health Service, NHS, as many new graduates do. However, one beer at a conference led to him doing a one-month student placement in Singapore, eventually leading to a move to Singapore and embracing a radically different cultural and professional landscape.
This episode tracks a personal journey of growth and discovery and dives into the strategic decisions that define a career path.
We Also Discuss:
- What is UFit Singapore and their Circle of Care?
- Hiring from Australia, the UK and New Zealand.
- Tax benefits of Singapore.
- Singapore is based on efficiency. Therefore, podiatry services must also be efficient.
You can connect with Lewis on LinkedIn, or you can email him directly at lewis.nurney@ufit.com.sg
26th – 27th July, 2024 – CAIRNS
This is the best two-day podiatry training program in the world, and it has been designed just for podiatrists. If you want to give your podiatry business the boost it needs, or you’re considering starting a podiatry business, block out the dates now and plan on attending. I guarantee you will love it and if not, I’ll give you 2X what you paid, that’s how confident I am.
If you have any questions about this episode, you can contact me at tyson@podiatrylegends.com
Schedule a FREE 30-minute Zoom Call with Me.
If you have questions about your podiatry business, team, personal goals and career direction, organise a time to talk with me. I’m here to help in any way I can. You have everything to gain and nothing to lose.
I recommend following the link below to my calendar and scheduling a free 30-minute Zoom call. I guarantee that after we talk, you will have far more clarity on what is best for you, your business and your career.
My SCHEDULE – https://calendly.com/tysonfranklin/podmeeting30
FACEBOOK GROUP Podiatry Business Owners Club – https://www.facebook.com/groups/podiatrybusinessownersclub
MY BOOK is available on AMAZON
It’s No Secret…There’s Money in Podiatry – https://amzn.to/3JhO9cz
“I was a frustrated business owner for five years until I started working with Tyson. He helped me transform my business in a matter of months, resulting in an instant increase in revenue and the ability to attract and retain top quality podiatrists. Over the past three and a half years, working with Tyson has changed my life drastically. I was able to take time off to start a family, triple my business revenue, and finally achieve work-life balance. I highly recommend Tyson to anyone who is looking for a business coach.”
– Jessica Haydock (Sole Focus Podiatry, Toowoomba)
YouTube
Have you checked out my YouTube Channel – TYSON E FRANKLIN?
Full Transcript – Unedited
Hi, I’m Tyson Franklin and welcome to this week’s episode of the Podiatry Legends Podcast. The podcast designed to help you feel, see, and think differently about the podiatry profession. With me today is a podiatrist from Singapore. I have Lewis Nurney with me. Lewis, how are you doing today?
[00:00:17] I’m very well, thanks Tyson.
[00:00:18] Thank you very much for having me on.
[00:00:19] It’s taken a little while to get you on here because you have been busy. You’ve had a few changes with your career as well, which we’re going to get into. And initially you’d studied in england
[00:00:33] Yeah, that’s right. , I was at the University of Huddersfield. So, I’m from, , Yorkshire, originally, as you can probably tell.
[00:00:39] I’ve got a terrible accent.
[00:00:40] But
[00:00:40] Well, I thought I’d point that out. That’s why I thought
[00:00:42] I’d, I’d point that out early that you’re from the UK, because people are going, okay, if they’re watching the video, they’ve figured it out. You’re not from Singapore. I think if they hear the accent, they’re going to go, geez, these people in Singapore, they sound like the British, don’t they?
[00:00:57] Yeah, that’s it. You’ll have to get the subtitles on all our videos. So [00:01:00] it’s fine. Don’t worry.
[00:01:02] No, I need to do that one. I have to get, we’re going to have Irish podiatrists on your subtitles.
[00:01:06] Yeah, I just
[00:01:07] nodded. Yeah, I remember one of our lecturers was the head of the podiatry department, Alan Crawford was Scottish.
[00:01:15] I remember having a Scottish patient coming in and he was like, I’m going, I have no idea what he’s saying. So let’s go and get Alan. Alan will be our interpreter. He comes in and the guy’s gone and Alan’s just walked out going, No idea. He’s from the Highlands, the Highlands somewhere.
[00:01:37] He’s just drunk.
[00:01:40] Yeah. So, , yeah. I studied in, , University of Huddersfield. So that’s yeah, west Yorkshire just between Sheffield, Leeds, Manchester and that kind of triangle. So the north you would consider. So yeah, that was back I graduated in 2018.
[00:01:54] It was and yeah, so really enjoyed my time studying and I was a little bit [00:02:00] lost in terms of direction of where to go next, after into my final year realising alright. Put my serious hat on in terms of we needed to look for a job. Yeah. And that was when this whole kind of conversation of potentially looking overseas started.
[00:02:15] And to, to be honest, , the reality of the situation was, while I was a student, I was working part-time in a a big chain of gyms across the Yorkshire. So in like head office, like a call center job basically, and selling kind of gym memberships and customer service stuff
[00:02:32] they used to give us commission for sales in terms of these gym memberships, and I ended up being quite good at that, and then working weekends because nobody wanted to do it, and when I had a first job offer from the podiatry job offer in the NHS, It was significantly less than what I was earning from selling gym memberships.
[00:02:50] I thought, Oh, something’s not gone
[00:02:51] right. Where did life take a wrong turn? I remember when I actually went through my day, when I graduated, [00:03:00] the first podiatry job I got offered was $2 an hour less than what I was getting paid at the chook farm to kill chickens.
[00:03:08] Oh wow. . Yeah, .
[00:03:10] I’m thinking, wow, after all that time at uni and I have to have insurance and registration, I’m getting paid $2 less per hour.
[00:03:18] Yeah. Someone’s wrongs gone. Not quite right. So, that was the kind of the situation. I was like, oh wow, well what am I gonna do about this? So I explored various avenues of what’s the best case scenario of podiatry in terms of is it in public practice? Is it a private setting? Is it with podiatry surgery?
[00:03:36] So , my university had a a pretty decent program for podiatry surgery masters pathway. So that was something that I was somewhat interested in, and I ended up going down that route for a little while and at the same time when I was starting that, I had the opportunity , to come to Singapore for an internship.
[00:03:53] So that, it all started from a conversation that the Podiatry Conference, I think, in Liverpool, the power of many conferences
[00:03:59] [00:04:00] too.
[00:04:00] That’s it. So I managed to scrape together some of , my gym sales money drive over to Liverpool and get a hotel for a night. And then, yeah, I just got networking, chit chat, and bumped into a guy , from Singapore who It was telling me about, oh, they’ve got a private practice over here.
[00:04:16] And to be honest, I’ve never even been to Asia and I had no idea where Singapore was.
[00:04:21] It beats my placement so far in the NHS. So I thought, well, let’s, let’s give that a try for a month and see, see what happens.
[00:04:28] So it was initially just a month that you went there for a placement just to It’s part of your training at the university and okay, so it wasn’t, you didn’t go there for the job straight up, purely a placement, it’s something different.
[00:04:41] Yeah, exactly. Yeah. So the university for this field is quite that was quite an attractive thing. They mentioned that they did have sort of some connections with overseas placements. And being from Barnsley, South Yorkshire, any chance of anywhere else is an improvement. Yeah. So I thought, well, what’s the worst that could happen?
[00:04:59] So, It’s [00:05:00] not raining
[00:05:00] as
[00:05:00] much.
[00:05:01] You’re
[00:05:01] going, where’s
[00:05:03] all the wet weather?
[00:05:05] Yeah, people do speak better English, actually in Singapore, than Barnsley, so yeah, that was a one month placement as part of my final year. So my clinical hours in terms of my sort of graduation. And while I was here, it just opened my eyes to a completely different world of podiatry.
[00:05:20] And life in general, really. So yeah, without my kind of, without my parents knowledge, I did actually accept a provisional job offer while I was in placement. So it was presuming I pass and get my grades and get my registration. There’s a job waiting for you in Singapore.
[00:05:36] What was the money like in comparison to what you’re being offered in the NHS to your first position in Singapore?
[00:05:44] Not in terms of money, not a massive difference to be fair, in terms of a starting, starting salary, it was not necessary that was the, the driving point. So it was all a , fixed salary and everything. And it was more of a little bit of an adventure, really, of something different.
[00:05:58] And what I was thinking to [00:06:00] myself, the dilemma was, do I stay and do the podiatry surgery masters course, or do I try this Singapore thing for, it was a two year contract that was offered originally. And at the time I was 21, I think. So I was like, well, Even if it doesn’t work out, I can go for two years, see how podiatry works in this private practice.
[00:06:19] And then if it’s terrible, I’ll come back and do my own practice or I’ll carry on with this podiatry surgery gig. Yeah.
[00:06:26] Yeah, but every podiatrist I know that has gone to Singapore to work has absolutely loved it.
[00:06:32] Yeah. It’s different. Yeah. It’s a very different experience.
[00:06:36] And I mean, Singapore, for those who have not been it’s, it’s a really unique situation because it’s tiny. The, whole country itself, I think is 700 kilometers squared. So you can drive across both ends in like an hour. Yeah. So it’s tiny and there’s, I think six, 6 million people, I think, in terms of population wise
[00:06:56] and I would say one of the main things is it’s really developed. And [00:07:00] obviously most global companies, their Asia headquarters will be in Singapore because for tax purposes, a lot lower tax rate.
[00:07:07] Ooh, what’s the tax rate? Since you mentioned taxes, that’s pricked everybody’s ears up.
[00:07:12] That’s it. So it is variable. It is a variable rate. But in terms of comparatively, back home in the UK would be 40 percent plus. Over here. I’m earning slightly more than I would be in the UK. It maxes out around 18 percent for me, 18, 19%. So it’s a significant tax relief. But in terms of corporate tax, I’m not sure the exact numbers, but it’s a lot less.
[00:07:35] Yeah.
[00:07:36] Okay. And, but I do know, like I’ve been there a couple of times and I think if you ever want to give up drinking, Singapore is the country you’re going to spend some time in. Okay. You’ll be sober. As soon as you go and buy your first bottle of bourbon and you see how much it took out of your wallet, you will never drink again.
[00:07:51] So.
[00:07:52] That’s it. Yeah, you’ll be broke before you’re drunk in Singapore.
[00:07:55] My God, I’ve never seen alcohol prices like it, but what was really interesting, we were there, I was there with [00:08:00] my brother. And I remember my sister in law saying to me, yes, but you notice you don’t see anybody walking around the streets at night drunk.
[00:08:08] The place is really clean. So there’s probably a method in their madness. We did find a vending machine though, in a hotel that had 5 beers. Oh, there you go. Worth the walk.
[00:08:18] Yeah. It’s a very unique place. And I mean, what I would say about Singapore, , in general, you can have a meal for 3 or you can have a meal for 3, 000.
[00:08:29] I mean, they’ve got everything. But you are right in terms of alcohol, it is heavily taxed. So it is a kind of, yeah, once in a while, I would say. It’s good.
[00:08:39] But you can find like what we did find was the local beer though was relatively inexpensive.
[00:08:45] So they’re encourage you, you drink the local beer. If you wanna be a drunk and and leave all the, if you wanna drink the overseas stuff, we’re gonna, we’re gonna smash you with taxes. Yeah, that’s it.
[00:08:57] That’s it. The same thing where, , expanding from just alcohol. I mean [00:09:00] any, Singapore doesn’t really manufacture anything major, so everything’s imported.
[00:09:04] So there is a heavy taxes on import stuff, so that’s why it’s, it’s
[00:09:08] an ing place though, because like Singapore Zoo is probably one of the best zoos I’ve ever been to. Oh, yeah. Yeah. I’ve never been harassed by so many orangutans.
[00:09:19] They’re just roaming around the place throwing stuff at you. And, but Santosa Island is a great place. It’s it is a very, anyone who hasn’t been to Singapore, if you’ve got the chance of going there just for a holiday, you need to go and do it. And then you can reach out to Lewis and make your trip tax deductible..
[00:09:38] That’s it.
[00:09:42] CPD sessions we’re always looking out for.
[00:09:45] Hey, that’s not a bad idea. We should do something in Singapore.
[00:09:48] Yeah, let’s do it. Let’s do it. There’s a good setup. In Singapore at the minute, the, so the unique situation is that there’s no podiatry school in Singapore. So there’s no, there’s a, I mean, As well as globally, there’s a shortage of podiatrists, but [00:10:00] in Singapore, it’s particularly bad because , there’s no feeder school.
[00:10:02] So the, in terms of like recruitment wise, we’re hiring from the UK and Australia as well. So we’re all fighting for the same new grads and same staff.
[00:10:11] So officially registered, I think there’s 125 podiatrists.
[00:10:17] It’s more than I
[00:10:18] thought.
[00:10:19] Around it’s only about a third of those are in private practice. Yeah. So the majority are in kind of hospital setting and that public sector. Yeah.
[00:10:28] Ooh, okay. We could do a two day podiatry business reboot in Singapore. That’d be good. That would be fun.
[00:10:35] Give me an excuse to go back up there.
[00:10:37] That’s it. And we’ll have a nice cold beer waiting for you. Just one.. And
[00:10:40] from Cairns, we get a direct flight. I think it’s only six hours. Perfect. All right.
[00:10:45] Yeah, it should be. Yeah, it’s about, I think eight, eight hours to Melbourne. So probably, yeah, probably six.
[00:10:51] Yeah, six hours to Cairns. So, I have no excuse not to do that.
[00:10:54] Oh,
[00:10:55] there you go. I’ll see you soon. So, you [00:11:00] took a position there. You’ve been there since 2018? Yes, that’s right.
[00:11:05] Yeah. So, I was initially, so the, the internship that I had was in a kind of a group practice in Singapore. And then I, so, yeah.
[00:11:14] Graduated in June, July, got my registration across by end of August and then started in September. So it’s straight in at the deep end, but the the practice at the time had around I think about 15 podiatrists, so quite a decent size group. Yeah, four, four clinic locations. And I was just, as I said, fresh off the boat.
[00:11:34] And the objective is just to be a sponge, really, and just learn whatever I can from anyone. While having this sort of new experience in Singapore. So it is a, so it was a private practice. And it’s a little bit different in Singapore in terms of insurance. So podiatry is not really claimable in terms of insurance, as is I think parts of the UK is where you can start to do that.
[00:11:53] So it is a little bit of a unique situation. But it was an excellent place to learn. I really enjoyed that. Learned a lot [00:12:00] and kind of got thrown out of the deep end really. So it’s kind of like, I’ve heard you say before, I’m good friends with Cameron Bennett and a couple of the guys.
[00:12:08] Yeah. And it was a case of kind of, yeah, learning on someone else’s dollar, really, which is great to build up the reps, build up the mileage. Yeah. So were you doing
[00:12:16] all aspects of podiatry, like as soon as you, in your first job, was it mainly sports or was it a broad aspect of podiatry?
[00:12:24] Pretty broad to be fair. We’d see all aspects of podiatry, a bit of routine care, a lot of musculoskeletal stuff. We did see a couple of pediatric cases as well. Not too many kind of diabetic wounds, but we did have a few. But mostly they’re more of the hospital setting in Singapore is great in terms of diabetic foot care and so this kind of wound management from a podiatry aspect.
[00:12:46] But it’s just those kind of musculoskeletal cases. It’s difficult to get in appointments and whatnot with public sector.
[00:12:51] So you were saying a third are in private practice. Two thirds are employed by the government, I take it, in hospitals. [00:13:00] In the hospitals, are they still doing all aspects of podiatry as well?
[00:13:03] I believe there’s an element of all aspects, but I think it’s predominantly diabetic foot care, high risk wound care some orthotics as well. But I think as far as I’m aware, , don’t quote me, but I think predominantly it’s a case of wound care and high risk foot care from what I’ve heard from my colleagues and stuff.
[00:13:19]
[00:13:19] Okay. So when you went straight into private practice in the group you were with, you stayed with that same group the whole time?
[00:13:25] Yeah, that was it. So it was stuck with the same group up until kind of late last year. So, yeah, I had two years two years of employment at the initial sort of start was like a quite heavily mentored.
[00:13:36] So obviously I was coming from a fresh grad, not really any experience or exposure. So, yeah. Quite heavily mentored, shadowed some of the senior guys and it was a rotation around around the clinics and different podiatrists , and just with an emphasis on learning as much as I can.
[00:13:48] And then it was progressed into my kind of own independent practice once I build up sort of confidence and a bit more kind of clinical maturity. Into the, by the end of it, I was the deputy head of [00:14:00] department for the team. So bringing in new grads and then mentoring and training and whatnot, and building up into that independent practice.
[00:14:09] So yeah, it was quite a good ride. But yeah, a lot of learning. Yeah.
[00:14:13] Yeah. So I’m curious because you said most of your new grads came from the UK and from Australia. Yeah. So you being at this clinic for six years, you would have seen a number of new grades come through. Yeah.
[00:14:25] How would you compare the two?
[00:14:27] Yeah. Good. Good question actually. And I would say there is a distinct difference. I would say to summarize, I would say Aussie pods typically have a lot more mileage in terms of MSK, a bit more kind of sports focused, a bit more private practice focused whereas a lot of the, the system predominantly in the UK is very much geared to once you’ve graduated podiatry, you could start an NHS job the next day, you could do that and be up to speed roughly in terms of, wound management and diabetic foot care and vascular assessment and screenings and all that [00:15:00] kind of stuff.
[00:15:00] Whereas I would say the typical Aussie pod has normally had a little bit more experience with orthotic design. A bit more confident in musculoskeletal assessments potentially. Just broadly generalizing it.
[00:15:11] That’s just the feedback I’ve When I’ve spoken to people in the past, I’m doing a, an episode with Jim McDannald in the not too distant future.
[00:15:19] And we’re talking about podiatry around the world, just from what we’ve experienced and what we’ve seen talking with different podiatrists. So we’re probably going to touch on this as well. And for what I’ve seen, it has been that way where people in the UK have said to me, when they do the training, you’re almost trained to go and work in the NHS for a while.
[00:15:38] National health system for people in the United States, you don’t know what we’re talking about. And to work in private practice is Ooh, a bit of the unknown and a little bit scary. Whereas Australian podiatrists seem to be, no, you graduate to go and work in private practice.
[00:15:52] Yeah. Yeah. I would completely agree.
[00:15:54] I mean, my, my kind of minimal experience of that exact scenario, I would agree fully. Yeah. [00:16:00]
[00:16:01] Okay. That’s good. I’m glad I asked that question because I was wondering, you would know firsthand because you’d be constantly getting them coming in. What’s the turnover of staff though? You were there for two years and you’ve stayed on.
[00:16:12] Do most people stay two years and leave or do they stay longer than the initial two years?
[00:16:18] It depends. And I would say there’s a a little bit of a stark difference and what I would say is I could circle back to your episode that you did recently about your Mexican Fisherman and the Banker.
[00:16:29] I listened to that on my way in this morning. Excellent, excellent analogy and great, great story. I would say, okay. Singapore is a very kind of fast paced environment, and in terms of developing your, mileage and earning potential as well and career development, it’s very good for that, but you can potentially miss out on some of that in terms of, , not necessarily work life balance, but in terms of having the ability to travel you can get that done, and it’s not, and You can travel a little bit, but in terms of building, like housing prices are really [00:17:00] crazy expensive in terms of for foreigners So it’s not really some place that you can settle down initially.
[00:17:05] I would say. Yeah, it’s very go go go It’s all full speed ahead. And I would say the intensity level is quite high in terms of career progression and kind of earnings wise, that’s great. I mean, you can definitely earn pretty high here in Singapore with that sort of tax rate and everything else, but I would say, so if you’re in that stage of your career, potentially, or if that’s the objective, and that’s that kind of suits your kind of personality, it’s really great for that.
[00:17:30] But , for example, I’ve got a couple of colleagues who I think they did three years and , they moved on to New Zealand for a little bit more of that slightly more relaxed kind of work life balance in that new job. Yeah. And that suited what they were looking for better.
[00:17:43] Yeah.
[00:17:44]
[00:17:44] It makes sense though, because I can understand like Singapore is, , isn’t it the gateway to Asia? Something like that. Yeah. And we, cause we know from Cairns, if we want to go to Thailand, we have to go Singapore, Thailand, where we can go [00:18:00] directly to Bali, but there’s a lot of other countries.
[00:18:02] Yeah. It’s all via Singapore.
[00:18:05] Yeah, that’s it. That’s it. So for example, you’re so Thailand, Vietnam Malaysia, Indonesia, everywhere from there, it’s within like a two and a half hour flight from Singapore. So you can have another couple of nice long weekends and stuff. So that’s,
[00:18:20] that’s good.
[00:18:21] So to go and buy a house there is expensive or an apartment. Yeah.
[00:18:26] Yeah.
[00:18:27] So initially a new grad getting there, they can make good money. They can do a lot of good travel. But it’ll take a little while before they’ve got the cash behind them if they really want to , settle down.
[00:18:36] Potentially, yeah, and I think it’s just how Singapore is viewed, it’s yeah, accommodation is really expensive in terms of rental and if you were ever to look at purchasing property. Cars are really expensive. So they’re heavily taxed as well. So it’s, it’s crazy. Yeah. So Singapore, I would say is probably the most efficient place I’ve ever been in terms of public transport.
[00:18:57] They don’t have
[00:18:57] Ubers there either, do they? There’s no Ubers in [00:19:00] Singapore.
[00:19:00] They do it, so they call it Grab now, so Grab and Uber merge, so it’s branded as Grab, but yeah. So , it’s, basically the issue is there’s no space, so you can’t have too many cars, or it’s gonna be traffic jam everywhere. So they heavily tax the cars, and then public transport is amazing and very cheap.
[00:19:17] Yeah, I remember seeing, I think the last time we were there, Uber wasn’t there, but we got a taxi. Okay. It was so cheap, just from, why would you bother? And the taxi driver was really, was actually friendly and nice to us. So we’re thinking, why would you need an Uber? And then I think there was like an average car that we may have paid 30, 000 for in Australia.
[00:19:36] It was like 70, 000 dollars. Probably more. Yeah. Okay. That’s why you could easily take a taxi and there were so many taxis around. It was really good.
[00:19:45] Yeah. That’s it. That’s it.
[00:19:47] So it’s , inner city lifestyle because you can’t drive for two hours.
[00:19:50] You run out on land. You know what I mean? You run out of Singapore. I actually wanted to do a
[00:19:57] lap. It also sounds like a really good place. [00:20:00] Someone who’s, I mean, Maybe worked for a few years. It’s got a bit of money behind them. They’ve had to say a bit of a career that maybe even had their own business.
[00:20:07] Yeah. 15,
[00:20:07] 20 years in the career. It sounds like a sort of place where you would go there as well, because you would have some money to buy a place. You may not want a car. You want that city living, but still make pretty good money as a podiatrist.
[00:20:20] Yeah, that’s it. That’s it. And I think what I would say is, , Singapore’s got a massive kind of expat community.
[00:20:25] So, within a kilometer of where we are, we’ve got Google head office, LinkedIn head office, Facebook, Netflix. And a lot of these this kind of head office, a lot of the staff are lots of expats from Europe, America, Australia, basically everywhere. So there is massively multicultural and massively kind of a melting pot of all cultures and everything really. So it’s great. Yeah.
[00:20:46] Yeah. That’s what we found when we were there. And my wife used to be in the travel industry and she always referred to Singapore as being the least Asian country in Asia.
[00:20:58] Yeah, something like that.
[00:20:59] She [00:21:00]
[00:21:00] said because it’s so integrated with so many other countries and cultures, just, it just works. Yeah. Even the accent they said, , it’s just different. It’s a really unique. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:21:13] I mean, if you want the taste that most people have been through the airport, if you’ve been from Oz to UK or anywhere, you normally have to stop through Singapore airport.
[00:21:20] And if you’ve seen that, I mean, the airport is amazing. We’ve got waterfalls, cinema, swim pools and stuff. I think, yeah, this is not quite Manchester airport where I’m used to.
[00:21:29] They actually have, I think they’ve got sleeping rooms there too. That if you’re, if you’ve got a stopover for like six or eight hours, you can go and rent a bed that you can actually go into, put your stuff down, go and have a sleep for six hours and then get back up again.
[00:21:42] Yeah, yeah, that’s it. That’s it.
[00:21:43] So, no, it’s, it’s great. It’s a very efficient place and what I would say is it’s a very kind of on demand culture, so nobody wants to wait for anything. So that’s, it’s fantastic to be on the receiving end of that, but obviously from a podiatry business point of view to now be delivering that on demand service, that’s a [00:22:00] little bit more.
[00:22:02] Yeah, it takes, it gears a little bit more of the decisions we’ve made with this kind of new, new clinic wise. Yeah.
[00:22:08] Okay. So let’s move on to, you say you were there for six years working for somebody else. And yeah. Now in the second half of 2023, you were approached to set up like a brand new podiatry department with UFit Singapore.
[00:22:21] Yeah. What is, UFit Singapore. Run us through all this . What, what does this all mean?
[00:22:26] So, basically UFit is a multidisciplinary hub for all things health and wellness. So initially kind of new fit started off as a bunch of personal training gyms. That’s how it started, and that was back in, I think, 2011 um, so over time it’s grew, and they’ve had physio, added a couple of different services and whatnot, and then I think in , the last two years, there’s been a big drive for this they’ve come up with this thing called the Circle of Care.
[00:22:55] So what that means is they want basically all aspects of your health and [00:23:00] wellness spend to be under one, one kind of group. So they’ve got, kids, tennis lessons, Muay Thai classes, fitness bootcamps, all the way through physio, osteopath, nutritionists. Sports and exercise science, sports medicine doctor, and now podiatry is the latest addition to that.
[00:23:20] Yeah. So
[00:23:22] this is all under one roof. So you could be working there as a podiatrist and then at the same time people are doing Muay Thai classes.
[00:23:28] Effectively, yeah. So there’s four locations in Singapore. We’re at the, the city center, so the CBD hub, we call it Club Street. So, so right now in the space that we are, we’ve got there’s personal training, strength and conditioning, nutrition upstairs, physio upstairs and it kind of sports medicine and sports massage as well.
[00:23:46] So basically what happens the patients can come in from any kind of spoke of the wheel. So they come in through physio or through nutrition or through podiatry or into a sort of through personal training, and then they can [00:24:00] access services within that kind of framework.
[00:24:02] So, , from a clinical point of view, is a kind of a no brainer in terms of over my kind of experience of my previous job, what I found is that patients who do the best and have the best results are the ones where they’ve got, often it needs multidisciplinary input.
[00:24:18] Some cases, so, they’ve come to you for heel pain and bit overweight and whatnot, and we’ll take care of the foot and ankle stuff, and maybe they need a plan and maybe they’ve got heel pain. They’ve started running and they’ve done a 10K I mean, on week one of training for a week. So it’s a case of we were, I mean myself and my colleague, we were trying practice in that way beforehand, but it was just a little bit messy in.
[00:24:43] I don’t know if you’ve actually been to the physio, I don’t know how you’re getting on. It’s you saying my insoles are shit and that’s why you need to, that’s why you’ve got heel pain, so. It’s a case of, it was a bit messy, and a bit inefficient in terms of, it was very non Singaporean in terms of getting things done.
[00:24:58] Because that’s what you were talking about before, with [00:25:00] Singapore, everything is about efficiency. So Ufit has been set up in a way to try and make the treatment more efficient for the patient.
[00:25:07] That’s it. That’s it. Yeah. So we run cause we were, we used to have trouble with kind of sending patients to physio or sending them to a nutritionist and that as well.
[00:25:15] I’ve got to drive over here and I’ve got this. And so in Singapore, no one’s got time for anything. Everyone’s in a rush. So, it’s a case of making it as a sort of a seamless as possible and offering as many services as we can under one roof. And ultimately the, obviously the aim of that is that the outcome for the patient is the best.
[00:25:32] Yeah.
[00:25:33] So they approached you to set up the podiatry department within the four locations.
[00:25:39] That’s, that’s it. Yeah. So it’s a bit of a long story. , so we had a working relationship with one of their physios. So I knew really well, a guy called Dave Lee. And we used to send patients back and forth just in terms of referrals and whatnot.
[00:25:51] And we used to grab a couple of coffees once in a while, and this was back in, I think, 2020. He said, Oh UFit having conversations about maybe adding [00:26:00] podiatry and expanding the services a little bit. And, and at the time we did have conversations, but it was I was quite happy in my current, my sort of, my old job at the time.
[00:26:08] And, and UFit was not, it’s not grown into what it is today. So it was mostly gym, a couple of physios. And then what happened is , mid last year conversations were happening potentially with Australia moving across to us and relocating, or different practices in Singapore.
[00:26:25] And it actually was a LinkedIn message. So I thought, , we’ve not spoken for three years, but let me just send a message and see if they want to grab a coffee. So, so yeah, we just sent a blind kind of LinkedIn message saying, I’m not sure if we’re backing up the wrong tree, but we spoke three years ago.
[00:26:39] Is it worth a conversation or not, let’s have a chat? It went from there really. So they were really keen to add in podiatry. I was in a position where I now have a little bit more mileage and experience and in a position where I can deliver a podiatry team because there’s a lot of colleagues and other podiatrists that were keen to potentially do something together.
[00:26:59] So yeah,
[00:26:59] it was. [00:27:00] Yeah, interesting. So you moved across there. Did other podiatrists come with you at the same time?
[00:27:05] Yes. Yeah. So there was two podiatrists a couple of admin and nurses as well. Just ripped the guts out of that other
[00:27:17] podiatry because he just dragged them all across with you.
[00:27:21] Yeah, not, not exactly.
[00:27:23] I would say the, it was the beauty of it was they were UFIT gave us a bit of a blank canvas to write, we’ve got a space, you guys know about podiatry, I mean, so I managed to convince UFIT that it was a good idea and we were the right people for the job and then had to work out how to actually deliver what I promised.
[00:27:39] Okay, so is UFIT still just in Singapore or have they expanded it out of Singapore?
[00:27:43] At this moment in time, just, just in Singapore. Yeah. But very close ties with London and also Middle East as well in Dubai. Okay. So yeah, potentially expansion in the future, but Singapore for now. Yeah. Okay. Who owns UFit?
[00:27:57] It’s a group. So there’s a, it’s privately owned. It’s [00:28:00] not a public company at the minute, but it’s a mix of shareholders. I think a New Zealand guy, a couple of British guys. Some local Singaporean guys as well. So it’s a bit of a mix. Yeah.
[00:28:09] Yeah. Okay. So, and then with the podiatry side things, you are purely there as an employee or are you like a part owner of the podiatry side of things?
[00:28:17] So I’d say the setup at the minute is an employee basis with a kind of a profit share. And a sort of the potential to buy into that in the future. But obviously this is kind of a new business within Ufit itself, so in the case of let’s see how we get on and also being a foreigner in Singapore it is uh, cause you need a work visa, so you need to be an employee first before you can be a company director.
[00:28:38] So there’s a little, yeah, the logistics of it’s a little bit messy, but effectively the Ufit podiatry department is run, we have our own separate P& L that I’m responsible for, and then we go from there basically, yeah.
[00:28:50] Yeah, because I was going to ask you about that, about working in Singapore itself, because you said there’s no podiatry school there, so every podiatrist has got to be imported.[00:29:00]
[00:29:01] Once you’re actually imported, so I assume there’s some Singaporeans who have gone off study to come back. They don’t need to get a work visa, but for everybody else, is your work visa like two years? Is it four years? Do you have to renew it? Do they boot you out after a certain time if you hang around too long?
[00:29:18] Well, it’s a yes to all of those. Yeah. So, so basically how it works is you have a sort of a work visa that’s in partnership with your employer. Yep. And that will be a kind of a fixed rate. And Singapore’s pretty, I would say pretty clever in what they do in terms of trying to support Singaporean employment.
[00:29:37] So, like you said, if, if I want to hire a Singaporean podiatrist versus a British or an Aussie podiatrist, potentially , the Aussie or the British podiatrist , would require a premium in terms of salary to get that work visa.
[00:29:52] What do you mean by requires a premium?
[00:29:54] You’ve got to pay more for that work visa?
[00:29:57] Effectively, work visas are [00:30:00] limited and they’re quite , hard to get. Yeah, so in terms of increasing your chances of a work visa they need so number one your company needs to have have a diversity amongst your team and also in terms of you need to be they, they set like a minimum salary requirement and stuff for, for podiatrists and each individual profession as well for foreigners. So, for example, finance industry has got a certain level and that, that goes with age as well.
[00:30:26] Age and level of qualifications as well factored in. So.
[00:30:29] So if you’re what percentage of podiatrists in Singapore are Singaporean?
[00:30:38] If I was to guess, I would say it’s probably around 50%. So, okay. How it, how it actually works is if you’re a Singaporean, wanna study podiatry, you need to study in Oz or in the uk.
[00:30:51] Now you can have, do that through your own student financing, which is pretty pricey an overseas student. Yeah. Or I believe Singapore does offer [00:31:00] scholarships for Singaporeans to study in Australia and the UK and what they would do is they would then be bonded to a public hospital system for a number of years until that’s that scholarship’s done.
[00:31:10] So you do, we do see a sort of a gentle kind of trickle of podiatrists coming out of public hospital once that kind of bond is over and then venturing out into private practice. Okay, so you’ve
[00:31:20] been there six years now. Are you eventually gonna Yeah. Ask for citizenship?
[00:31:26] Well, it is tough, I’ve got a Singapore girl or you gonna marry
[00:31:28] a, I was gonna say if you get a Singaporean girlfriend and you eventually marry her.
[00:31:33] Make things easy.
[00:31:35] Well, it seems like a tough deal at the minute, so we’ll see how long I can get away with it.
[00:31:41] So, but is there a limit? Do they, like, if your work visa keeps getting renewed, do they have a limit or an age limit? They go, you’re getting too old now. Get out and let somebody young come through, anything like that?
[00:31:53] Not, not necessarily. It’s not as straightforward as that. It’s a kind of, basically what’s considered is what are you [00:32:00] contributing to Singapore society? That’s the main thing. So if you’re a general menace and Drunk every day, hanging around bus stops, it’ll probably not last very long, but if you’re, if you can prove that, look, I’m I’m seeing X amount of Singaporean patients, I’m servicing the podiatry needs of Singaporeans, we’ve got other stuff going on as well.
[00:32:19] So if you’re adding value to Singapore, you can stay.
[00:32:22] That’s the way it works. And you said at the beginning, when we were talking, that There’s a lot of recruitment opportunities to work in Singapore still that you’re still looking for podiatrists.
[00:32:32] Yeah, that’s it So, basically in in Singapore as we’ve mentioned it’s very difficult to recruit and there’s not really any kind of feeder of sort of podiatrists locally so it is a case of looking at Oz and New Zealand and UK as well in terms of looking for recruitment so most podiatry clinics are always hiring at all times in terms of, yeah, most people are open to conversations just because it’s that difficult to hire people.
[00:32:59] But [00:33:00] I would say, it’s definitely, it’s not for everyone but what, we would suggest is that for myself and my colleagues here at UFit, I mean, a lot of podiatrists are in and out of Singapore on holidays and Bali and Thailand yeah. We’ve had a sort of, I mean, we’re pretty, we’re pretty out there on our social medias and stuff, So we would encourage, if any podiatrists are flying in and out and want to grab a coffee or a beer and come and visit, , that’s what we do.
[00:33:22] Just have a chat and then have a conversation with us and see what works.
[00:33:26] Just pointing out to beer, not spirits, cause they’re too expensive.
[00:33:30] Yeah. Yeah. That’s it. Just one beer.
[00:33:32] You’re only getting one. Coffee’s fine. Coffee’s cheaper. You only get one beer. That’s all that’s in Lewis’s budget.
[00:33:40] That’s it, that’s it.
[00:33:41] So, yeah, I mean, that’s the kind of the situation. , in terms of internships is something that we would love to add as well. So it’s something that we’re drawing up at the moment in terms of so we’re pretty well connected with universities in the UK and Australia as well. So it’s something that we’ve it’s not, not finalised just yet, but something that we’re working on to offer kind of official placements and internships.
[00:33:59] [00:34:00] Out of curiosity.
[00:34:02] What’s the starting salary for a podiatrist in Singapore off the top of your head?
[00:34:05] So, if we were to hire someone tomorrow as a fresh grad, , probably maybe about 7, 300 Aussie dollars a month. Okay. Yeah.
[00:34:17] That works out about 87, 600.
[00:34:21] Okay. Okay. So it would probably be a little bit more than that by the time it’s by the time we’re done with everything else. So yeah, probably I would say closest around 90 to a hundred in terms of Aussie dollars. But obviously the amount that you keep is a lot higher , than what you would in initially from tax purposes.
[00:34:39] Cause , that tax is variable, right? So, yeah. Yeah. So it’s also the experience. Yeah.
[00:34:45] I think to myself when I graduated back when Noah was still nailing the arc together and like podiatry has changed so much since then. And it’s great. Like I kept up with everything as it was going through and [00:35:00] enjoyed my career while I was doing it.
[00:35:01] But I look at the opportunities are there for new graduates now where they can travel overseas, whether it’s UK or places like Singapore , and other places. It’s just the world is so small.
[00:35:15] That’s it. And I mean, that’s what I always tell people. People always ask me, why did you choose podiatry?
[00:35:20] Nah. Yeah. I mean, one of the main things in this job, so that allowed me to. Travel to completely the other side of the world. I’ve built a new life for myself over here, a new career, friends, family, everything. So it’s yeah, it’s been great. Podiatry has allowed me to do that. So, without podiatry, I’d be, I wouldn’t be in Singapore.
[00:35:37] So, you wouldn’t be on this podcast either. That’s it. That’s the pinnacle of my career so far.
[00:35:47] You have to have done more than this. But that’s what I say with new graduates. Some of ’em, they grew up in a certain town and they go to university that’s close to their town and as soon as they graduate they just wanna [00:36:00] go back to their town ’cause their boyfriend or girlfriend or family’s there.
[00:36:02] And I’m thinking, the world is a big place, get out there and experience it. And then you can always go back home and live your closed in, in your little capsule lifestyle. And I did that when I graduated, I was too scared to leave Southeast Queensland. That’s where I grew up. That’s where I wanted to stay.
[00:36:26] And then one day I jumped in my car and I drove 20 hours north to Cairns, completely different lifestyle. And. I’ve got no intentions of ever heading back where I’ve been the last 30 something years and it’s like living in a different country. Perfect.
[00:36:41] Exactly. And I think, that’s the main thing.
[00:36:43] I mean, Singapore, as I said, being so efficient, advanced and technology wise as a country itself, but then in terms of like, podiatry aspects for us in our private practice, we We emphasize a lot of kind of technology and , that’s what we’ve found helps drives a lot of our revenue and drives a lot of our kind of new patients coming in [00:37:00] is having access to these kind of technologies.
[00:37:02] So we have diagnostic ultrasound in clinic, we’ve got focused shockwave radial shockwave therapy, all this kind of stuff. And our latest toy is this new 3D printer is the the latest thing, it’s been great. Yeah, we’ve been getting there. Yeah, we’ve been I mean the decision was a bit of a long one.
[00:37:21] So basically in Singapore as we speak, there is no orthotics lab in Singapore. There is one that’s been opened up for the next couple of months, but yeah, there’s no, no direct orthotics lab. So in my old company and most of the rest of the practices in Singapore, orthotics are all from Australia.
[00:37:38] And what we’ve found is obviously the busier you get, that cost adds up. And then there’s import tax on top of that. And that really stings you a little bit , on the costs. And also the timeline as well.
[00:37:49] So obviously, it can vary between labs, but obviously somewhere between kind of 10 days to two to three weeks, depending on the imports and all sorts. So we were having a bit of a headache with that.
[00:37:59] Yeah, it’s way too [00:38:00] long. And
[00:38:00] we were, that’s it. I mean, in Singapore, , people are already pissed off if the taxi’s not here in two minutes.
[00:38:05] So a month for an install is not going to fly very long. So with this kind of setup, we’ve obviously we’ve invested, we’ve got all those fancy Zebra treadmills and the printer setup. And with that setup that we’ve got, we can turn around a fully 3D printed customer product in 24 to 48 hours.
[00:38:22] Yeah. So obviously the production cost is a lot lower, and so we’re faster, more efficient, and then we can obviously market that as our, that’s our USP, the fastest install in Singapore.
[00:38:34] Yeah, well I had my milling machine in Cairns and it was great. It took 12 and a half minutes to mill out a pair of orthotics after you did the design.
[00:38:44] And so we used to say, Oh, they’re ready for you tomorrow. And if you want them the same day, you just need to give us some warning and we can make sure it’s done. Which is great when people are traveling like Singapore, they just, they’ll be there in 15 minutes. It’s so you probably don’t need it that [00:39:00] urgent.
[00:39:00] But I still think I look at, The profession as a whole and how long patients still have to wait sometimes to get a pair of orthotics and I just shake my head going, it shouldn’t be that way. Everyone , should have moved on and should be doing something far and all labs should have come up with ways of getting them out faster and get them back to patients or back to the clinics.
[00:39:25] So they can fit the patient within days, not weeks.
[00:39:28] Yeah, that’s it. I mean, it’s not my area of expertise in terms of the actual manufacturing processes and all that. So I don’t want to bash the labs too much. But at least for us in terms of Singapore, everything, every company you speak to is trying to do everything faster and more efficient.
[00:39:42] So as podiatrists, why should I not do that? You know what I mean?
[00:39:46] I agree. And the thing is, by you doing it so fast, I will guarantee within the next five years, every private podiatry practice in Singapore is doing it the same way. Because all it takes is one person to do it. And once [00:40:00] they go, Oh shit, that means we all have to do it now.
[00:40:03] We all have to actually be more efficient. And I reckon that’s exactly the same with all. If there’s an orthotic lab listening to this, be the first one to pull your finger out and actually set your lab up in a way that as soon as, whether it’s a cast, a scan, whatever it is comes in. Employ the people to get it out, buy the extra equipment to get it out really fast, and you will dominate.
[00:40:24] Yeah. That’s a problem that people pay to fix. I mean, we’ve paid a significant amount of money for a printer to fix that problem. So yeah, there’s, there’s a lot of opportunity there for sure.
[00:40:34] So if people want to get in touch with you, they want to come over and have that one beer that’s in your budget.
[00:40:42] What’s, the best way of getting hold of you?
[00:40:46] So, we’re available on all platforms. Our official website is UFit.com.sg So if you just search UFit Singapore, it’ll come up
[00:40:56] In terms of myself and my colleague Elliot, we’re on Instagram and [00:41:00] everywhere as well. So mine’s Lewis Nurney podiatrist. And my colleagues on there as podiatrists, Elliot Yeldon. So I’ll I’ll send you that details across. But yeah, we’re easy to find.
[00:41:09] Yeah,
[00:41:10] but I’ll put, I’ll have all the details in the show notes as well. I thought you might, yeah, look up onlyonebeer@lewisnurney.com
[00:41:20] That’s it, that’s it. It’s going to cost me a fortune, so I should have not come on here.
[00:41:25] But I, like you said, you pointed out, like I know so many podiatrists that go to Bali, that go to Thailand, gone to Vietnam, so I’m thinking if you’re going through Singapore, yeah, just stop in, stop in, have that beer, check out the place. And at least then, even if you have no intentions on ever working there yourself, at least have a better understanding of what’s happening with podiatry in Singapore.
[00:41:47] So if you happen to bump into another podiatrist that’s looking for a new opportunity, there may be a place to go. Exactly. That’s
[00:41:52] exactly it. And I mean, my, my whole move to Singapore started from a beer and a conference. So yeah. Just one beer? [00:42:00] Just
[00:42:00] the one beer. And that was in England too. My God, I didn’t realize they sold them in ones in England.
[00:42:08] Yeah. Just one gallon. Yeah.
[00:42:10] Yeah. Oh, that’s, yeah, it was, it a, it was a gallon glass. . Okay. So, Lewis, I want to thank you for coming on the Podiatry Legends Podcast. This has been fun. We have lot. Thank you so much. This has been really good and I think it’s helped too ’cause I’ve been to Singapore a few times, so I,
[00:42:25] yeah, yeah.
[00:42:26] I have a feel for the place. I, like it too. I, and I’m looking forward to coming back one day and and when I come over, we’re gonna have. I’m going to budget. We’ll have more than one beer. Perfect. Well, thanks so much for having
[00:42:38] me on, Tyson. No, It’s been , great to chat. And if there’s something to work out for a business workshop or something in Singapore, let’s do it.
[00:42:46] Oh, that sounds good to me. Okay. Okay, let’s say thanks for coming on. And yeah, well, I’m sure we will catch up in the not too distant future.
[00:42:55] Thanks very much. Okay. Bye.